On the Real Estate

KELLY: the education things, the learning more

about the real estate, reading real estate Books

and going on real estate Forums. You should be

wanting to do all of that stuff because that's

what's setting you apart from everyone else.

JASON: Welcome to On The Real Estate with Kelly

DuBois, a show for real estate agents at any level,

buyers, sellers, or anybody interested in this

crazy real estate industry. I'm Jason Gillican,

CEO of Ear Fluence, and Kelly, I'm so excited

to chat with you today about a personality trait

that some people might feel is a positive for

real estate agents and people in sales. Some might

completely disagree. So I've been in sales as

a background my entire career, and so I'm excited

to talk to you about this.

KELLY: I'm always excited to talk about real estate

and personalities and people.

JASON: And your face, you're confused by why anybody

would say this could be a positive trait for sales.

But what we're gonna talk about in general is

arrogance, cockiness.

KELLY: Yeah.

JASON: But let's start off with, what are some

positive personality traits that you see in super

successful agents?

KELLY: I think that they're able to not make things

personal. not make things about themselves. It's

always about the client. Leaving your arrogance

kind of at the door, I suppose. I also think that

it is being able to be a team player because that's

probably one of the most important things. At

the end of the day, you want to be able to get

to the closing table and that's going to work

only if you can play with both sides.

JASON: Do you want to shout out anybody that you've

seen in your career that... has been somebody

that can do that really well.

KELLY: Yeah, there's a lot. I mean, if you've

been a real estate agent for over five years,

you can do that really well. There's a ton of

great real estate agents who are able to do it.

And I think that's also part of the irony. You're

superdouches or arrogance. They're either really

new, which is funny. or they're mediocre, who

have been like kind of just hanging on. But your

most badass agents, they're not, they're not in

that arrogance range. They're like. Let's do this.

I think at that point, they don't need to be arrogant.

And that's the difference. To me, if you're arrogant.

You're constantly having to feel like you're proving

something or you're trying to intimidate somebody

that you are more than you really are. Your numbers

in real estate or any sales speak for themselves.

Yeah. So at the end of the day, I'm in a mood

and I have a super douche on the other side. I'll

look up their numbers and compare them. And if

I have to look up an agent's numbers in my market,

you're already less. I already know it because

the numbers that I follow, they're on top. I already

know who they are.

JASON: Yeah. Note to self, name this episode,

don't be a super douche.

KELLY: Super douche. Don't do it. Yeah, I don't

like it. I don't, I mean, I can see your, where

you were kind of going with that. with the fact

that you need leadership. Yeah. You need to have

confidence. But there's a big difference between

confidence and arrogance, I think.

JASON: Yeah, no, I'm not talking about leadership

at any level. So in my sales career, I've seen

some people come in and they are not team players

at all. But they get on the phones and their cockiness

will come through on the phone. And so people

believe what they're telling them. Like they're

pretty good at selling. But at the same time,

like... there's a cap to how high they can get

by being somebody who is arrogant.

KELLY: I don't like arrogance in general. I genuinely

don't. Again, I'll stick with it. Your numbers

and how far you're gonna survive in any sales

position is going to speak volumes. But 86% of

people that get a real estate license don't practice

real estate in 12 months.

JASON: So why is that you?

KELLY: I mean. I don't think you're gonna get

very far with the whole arrogance card. But I

also think that the arrogance also is a different,

I don't know if it's a different demographic or

a different generation, but I do find most people

that have a little bit of a struggle of trying

to do real estate and realize that you have to

get to the other side with, or you have to get

to the closing table with the other side. I think

that it's people that come from positions that

were not really sales. I think they were higher

up positions in corporate America to where they

probably are not used to genuinely working by

themselves. They're used to having an assistant

or a team that did everything for them, and they

were just the ones that were lucky enough to get

the praise. And I don't think that that is also

how you're very successful in real estate. You

need to back yourself up with a really great team

that you connect yourself to, like your lender,

or your attorneys, or inspectors, things like

that. Bye. they're not doing the work for me,

right? You as the agent are doing the work. So

I think it's interesting when I take a step back

and realize the people who I think come across

are the agents that come across with the arrogance.

I mean, it sounds ridiculous to keep on saying,

but with the arrogance or to perceive that they're

more than they're not, or more than they are.

Like, I don't care what you did in your past job.

I don't care if you worked for NASA. I don't care

if you were a surgeon. I don't care if you ran

RTP and helped build it. I don't care because

you're not in that position anymore. So it's irrelevant.

Let's talk your real estate numbers. Let's talk

what you have done in the last 12 months. And

if you haven't done anything in 12 months, because

you're that new, that's okay. But then I wonder,

why are you arrogant?

JASON: Yeah.

KELLY: I think you have to be humble, because

you'll get knocked down really fast in here. And

I don't want to ever come across as a mean girl,

but I have no problem putting somebody kind of

in their place either.

JASON: Yeah, now let me push back just a little

bit because I don't think you should be arrogant

by any means, but there's a fine line between

being confident and being cocky slash arrogant.

because in sales, in real estate, you're gonna

get knocked down a lot.

KELLY: A lot.

JASON: Like you're gonna spend so much time with

a potential buyer or seller, and then that time

will amount to zero at times. And that hurts.

KELLY: Oh, yeah. People don't, I'm glad you brought

that up, because people don't also realize that,

one, there's zero loyalty in real estate. Well,

I think there's very little loyalty in anything

in general, right? But then you're talking about

in real estate, as an agent, you are a dime a

dozen. I mean, there's a million real estate agents

out there. So if. You know, you could be working

with somebody, like you said, for months, months,

and shown them. hundreds of houses, and then,

God forbid, you don't pick up your phone because

you're at your kid's sporting event, or you're

on a date, or you're sick, they'll just call another

real estate agent, lo and behold, that'll be the

house of their dreams, they'll put in an offer,

and you get paid nothing. That's it.

JASON: So how do you, okay, how do you get knocked

down then without losing confidence, right? To

some degree, you need to think like, oh, I'm still

good, like I'm still great at this job, even though

you just spent a ton of time and you got nothing

from that. You need to have some sort of... not

arrogance, but you know, some sort of self-confidence

that, you know what, this is gonna happen, optimism

even.

KELLY: Oh yeah, I'm all about being positive and

like the whole manifesting thing. I'm working

on it because I'm snarky. You know, that's a big

thing. I am. you do have to have a positivity

and a confidence that you are going to succeed.

Like. I'm going to succeed. I know that. Now,

by saying that, does that make me sound arrogant?

I don't know. You tell me, you just heard me say

it. I'm going to succeed. I guess if I just say

it. That's one thing, but then can you follow

it up with a why? And I guess for me, I'm going

to succeed because, well, failure's not an option.

Hmm. I really don't want to go back to any other

job or position. And I guess I genuinely know

I'm good at this job. And to say that... That's

not just my opinion. I can follow it up from.

hundreds of reviews. I can follow it up with success

of me of staying relevant in this market. for

five plus years. And that's a really big thing.

Are you still relevant in a market? When I say

relevant, it's not a popularity contest. It's

do you still have consistent buyers and sellers

wanting to work with you? Yeah. And if a client

wants to work with you, if people are still referring

you, and when I say people, I'm talking... buyers

and sellers like past and present clients, but

also other people. in the industry, your closing

attorneys, your lenders, you know, even other

agents. I work with a lot of referral agents that

are not... you know, directly in my area. And

actually, even agents who are in my area, I had

an agent, yes, or I had a client. Yesterday a

buyer, I have a listing. and He called me and

he's like, I'm working with this agent right now.

She is on vacation at the beach. She just told

me to call you directly. and wanted just said,

you know, she's unable to help me right now, but

I really wanted to see this house. I have a great

working relationship with that agent. I will,

I scheduled to show him that house and if he moves

forward with that house, I will just. give him,

hand him back to her if it's something we can

work out. That's how you make great relationships,

not constantly. building a wall between other

agents. queen of second guessing myself and my

biggest critic, which... is probably not a very

confident trait, but I will be like, oh shit,

I shouldn't have said that, or oh, I should have

done, you know, like I'll replay things at three

o'clock in the morning, and they're all of criticisms.

or how I should have maybe handled the situation

differently or if it would have been handled in

a different way, would have had a different outcome.

Yeah. Which is ridiculous. They're all things

that I'm saying right now that can no longer be

controlled but are still controlling my mind.

Yeah. But you do have to have a confidence to

yourself because I will say certain things to

myself and be like, you know, I'll pump myself

up and be like, we're gonna do this.

JASON: Yeah.

KELLY: You know?

JASON: Well, I think real estate is such a relationship

based industry. You've got to have those relationships,

like you mentioned, with the lenders, with other

members of your team, with buyer's agents, if

you're a seller's agent, all these different people,

right? And so if you're coming across as arrogant,

if you're coming across as like, you're better

than everybody else, Who's gonna wanna work with

you?

KELLY: No one. And the point of like building

those relationships, it's so underestimated and

essential for you to build those relationships

with other agents. I know I've said this before

in a past podcast. But like with the agent that

reached, that's that agent's client that said

just, Kelly will handle it, she can. There's two

things I know. She probably just genuinely wants

to have time at the beach with her family. which

is hard. Real estate, you kind of have a joke.

If you're ever not really busy with clients, just

go on vacation, all of a sudden, everybody and

their brother will want you. So that probably

is happening with her. But also for the other

aspect, I would never ever be like, oh, thanks

for your client, we're closing, and high five,

and never give him back or not give her her commission

based for that. That's her client. and I think

that that's something really important. Actually,

an agent told me a long time ago, and I will do

a shout out, an agent named Martha Lucas with

Remax United told me a long time ago when I was

a baby agent. The minute you start making real

estate about the money is the minute you fail.

Well, the minute that you start just making it

all about the commission checks and the dollar

signs and you are going to automatically stop

worrying about your clients, your reputation,

and being able to work with other agents. And

that is probably one of the... best pieces of

advice I've ever gotten in real estate because

it is so true. The minute you make it all about

money. And then there's an irony to that too,

because I say, I'll say to my newbie agents, whether

they have been agents. and just kind of came over

to our firm or agents that literally just got

there, passed their real estate test, I will tell

them whenever, you know, they're even talking

about, you know, coming in and wanting to hang

their license with us. The first thing I will

say to an agent is, do you like money? I will

come in every time, do you like money? And I want

to see how their face and body language reacts.

And the ones that automatically feel uncomfortable

or even like perplexed, they're not going to be

a top notch agent. They're not going to be a top

producing agent. the ones that right away are

like, hell yeah, I like money, I love money, I

like expensive things. That's going to be. That's

it. You have to like money to do anything in sales

because like we just pointed out, you don't get

paid if you don't close or work. It's all sales.

So you have to like money to keep that hamster

wheel spinning. You have to like money to be able

to keep going. You have to like money to be rejected

over and over again and hung up on. And if you

come on my property one more time, I'm going to

shoot you or call the police. Like, you're just

kind of like, oh, see you next week. Same time,

same place. You know, you have to be able to feel

okay calling somebody 10 times. Now not 10 times

in one day, but 10 times in say, you know, Two

months, and eventually, your goal is not to completely

and totally wear them down to where you get a

restraining order in the mail. But your goal is

to be like, they're resilient. They're confident.

They're a hard worker, you know? And those are

your traits that you need. So I can appreciate

like, you know, the whole, is that arrogance?

I don't know, is it arrogance to maybe a little

bit to keep bothering somebody? But I don't know

if it's genuinely bothering if they're picking

up the phone from you. If you've not been blocked,

you don't really know what you want at that moment.

JASON: Well, think about it from the other side,

right? If a real estate agent was calling me 10

times over two months, if I was actively looking

for a house, You know, I might not pick up the

first nine times because I'm playing with my kids

right then or I'm in a work thing right then.

Like, what are the odds that I'm actually gonna

pick up my phone? pretty slim. And so like, if

somebody is still interested in my business and

I have not told them like, look, stop calling

me. Like that's an invitation to keep calling

me.

KELLY: Yeah. Yeah. And that's how I look at it

too. Cause people are like, oh, you're going to

call them again or oh, you know, yes. Until they

literally say, Hey, Kelly. or that would be the

nicest thing they could say. Don't call me. But.

That's fine. I mean, I've got super thick skin.

I have three brothers and I have an ex-husband.

You're not gonna hurt my feelings. You're not

gonna hurt my feelings. So it is what it is.

JASON: You've told me that you've had to tell

agents, you're not special.

KELLY: You're not special.

JASON: Yeah, so talk a little bit more about that.

KELLY: Your mom thinks you're special. Hopefully,

hopefully. Well, I guess that goes back to...

Me preventing arrogance. That's my public service

for preventing more arrogant humans. But you're

not special in sales. You're grinding and you're

constantly moving and hopefully improving yourself

and getting better and building confidence in

relationships. But... What would make a real estate

agent really that special? I don't even know.

I don't even know, again, sales. What would make

a salesperson so special? What? What in any job

makes somebody so special? Are you special because

you worked your ass off? Great. But shouldn't

you work your ass off if you're the one that wants

the money and to reap the rewards? Ironically,

I think in this industry of sales as a whole,

I think the harder you work, the harder you grind,

and the more you put your name out, the more shade

you're gonna get thrown at you, the more hate

you're going to get, the more little whispers

or tidbits about that person you're going to hear.

So really, ironically, I think the more successful

you become, be prepared for a little bit of the

hate. And I think when you start to receive the

hate, you're starting to make it. You're starting

to ruffle some feathers. You're starting to be

noticed. And that's an interesting thing to say

because I do remember the first time that I was,

I received some hate. And... It bothered me more

than I would. Well, what happened? I thought.

It was actually an agent in my office that told

me what somebody had said about me. And we were

having an agent meeting and it was a builder that

said, oh yeah, Kelly's a bitch. I really don't

want to, I don't have any desire to attach our

name with her and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

And I was like, I never met that person. I never

met that person. What in the world? So it really

bothered me because There are a lot of people

who do think that I can be a bitch or I can be

abrupt or I can be, um... obstinate and that's

all well deserved. It genuinely is because if

I'm working with somebody or representing somebody,

there are gonna be times no matter how well I

play with the other side that I do have to remember

I'm representing one side. one side is who I have

my fiduciary duty to. So if we cannot both meet

in the middle and make this. happen, there are

going to be times where I'm going to have to have

to fight for my client or fight for my firm. Because

I have two roles, I have two hats. So there are

times whenever I know that those things being

said about me are well deserved, but I also know

that there are times when those things are being

said about me, I did an amazing job. because I

represented my client the best I could. I did

keep my heels in, you know, I did not. cower or

cave for them and get them less. So when I heard

that about the other, I had to stop and think

about it. And it bothered me one, that somebody

was talking about me that I had never known or

dealt with. And it was about me, but I think the

thing that also really bothered me is, it was

being impacted in a negative way now for the firm.

And as a co-owner now, I was being, reeled into

where it almost felt like the firm was kind of

getting backlash because of them not liking me.

And then I had to, I couldn't, I can't let things

go. I'm like a freaking pit bull. So like once

I'm like put my teeth into it, I'm not letting

go until I decide it's time to let go. So I had

to think about it like, well, our firm does a

ton of commercial land deals and we work with

national builders and we work with regular local,

you know, smaller builders. And I was like, where

did that come from? Well, there is one builder

that as a buyer's agent, I've sold their product,

we have had to go back and forth. Well, it ultimately

had come down to that of them not liking the way

that I, two deals had gone down now. Two deals

went down in a sour way because that builder did

not follow through with their contract for the

buyers and I made them change things out. One,

the siding was wrong. They're not gonna pay for

it. And I even gave them the choice. You don't

have to take the whole siding down. That sounds

crazy. Just give them a price reduction then.

That's what my clients wanted. They did not care.

And then the other one was a house that we should

have closed on and they kept changing the closing

date and then to accommodate them. And at that

point, they were in breach of contract as a builder

slash seller. So again, that was also going to

be something that needed to be handled. So. I

was a bitch because I stood up for my clients

to get them what they needed, which is fine, I

don't care. but now the fact that they were talking

about me to somebody. else that I'd never had

any dealings with, that frustrated me. Bye.

JASON: Like you said, once you get the hate, like

that's how you know you made it.

KELLY: So I mean, that builder is going to, oh,

this is gonna be an arrogant comment, you guys.

I just realized it, but is it arrogant or comfort?

That builder is going to need my firm more than

I'm ever gonna need that builder.

JASON: That's right.

KELLY: So is that arrogance? Maybe. That's just

facts. Or it's just facts, really.

JASON: So, okay. Yeah, that's awesome. I think

the last point on arrogance that we should touch

on. is education and growing yourself. Because

I feel like if you're arrogant, you don't really

feel like you need to learn or you're not really

taking that continuing education seriously. Because

you don't have that humility to be like, okay,

there are things that I need to learn to make

myself better. Have you seen that in real estate

agents?

KELLY: I see that in my own agents. I see that

in all real estate agents. It's so frustrating

to... have that happen and see that because You

know, if you are a real estate agent or if you're

not a real estate agent, fun fact, July 1 is whenever

all forms, like your real estate forms, They are

all updated. So as of July 1, they're all new

or have slight changes or tweaks to them. So that's

the whole point of CEO classes, continuing education

classes. Real estate agents have to take eight

hours, two classes of continuing ed classes. Well,

the continuing ed classes start in July. So we

are here, right? We just hit this. All the new

forms now have implemented any changes. You find

those out in your continuing ed classes, which

are mandatory. The commission makes you take those.

If you don't, then you're in trouble with the

commission. But as a firm, we'll do trainings

and meetings to review the changes, to review,

you know, point out where the differences are.

And sometimes they're so slight, they're really

difficult to even notice. But sometimes they're

so slight, they're easy to miss. And if you miss

them and there's an issue, that's coming back

on the agent and the firm. So we're off, we do

these classes right now and I'm telling you, today

we have a meeting and it's like pulling teeth

getting our agents there. Now my baby agents,

my newbies, they're there. I just love them. They

are so anxious and ready to learn. But my past

agents who are starting to get a little bit comfortable

are kinda like, yeah, I might make it. I'm like,

mm, you're gonna be there. Because that's starting

now, when I hear I might make it, I'm starting

to hear, ooh, we're getting a little too big for

your britches. And it's time for me to say, you're

not special. I love you, but you're not special.

and don't become that person to think you're exempt.

and get your tail to the meeting so that you can

hear about the changes, which are going to set

you a step above anybody else who's not willing

to do that. And that's the thing is like the education

things. the learning more about the real estate,

reading real estate Books and going on real estate

Forums. that, you should be wanting to do all

of that stuff because that's what's setting you

apart from everyone else. That's what's making

you, that is what is going to make you a little

bit more special. That is what's going to make

you more successful. That is going to... be what's

going to save you. when you look like a superhero

to your client because you caught something that

the other side missed. And when you do that, when

you catch something that the other side missed,

you very nicely reach out to that agent on the

other side. Don't make them feel like a dumbass

and simply inform them of it. Let them make the

changes. and that's it. That's all you have to

do. Be knowledgeable. Be respectful. and just...

Be willing to help and learn. But the minute you

stop wanting to learn and be helpful. You're going

to be one of those 86%. Because if for nothing

else, other agents will want to run you out and

don't think that doesn't happen. I can't rest.

JASON: Ooh, okay. That is good stuff. You think

about the Forums and the CEs and the Books. What

if that CEO class helped you not lose $10,000

in commission? What if a book that you read and

you got one idea from that, that helped you get

an extra $10,000 in commission because you're

able to sell or you're able to contact a potential

buyer for whatever reason? What if one forum idea

got you something where you made a little bit

more money because of that? Just the one thing.

Let's say it's a two hour class. In that two hours,

if you can make or not lose thousands and thousands

of dollars in commission, it's certainly worth

it.

KELLY: Yeah. I mean, there's a great book. I think

the one real estate agent, like my real estate

agent, like Hero, would probably be Gary Keller

for Keller Williams. He's spectacular. He has

a great book out there. You can get it on Amazon.

It's like $11, people. Read it, you know, but

you have to make it through the whole thing. It's

just wanting to make yourself a little bit set

apart from the others. Don't, don't. Don't just

fall into the own, you know, I always say that.

Don't let yourself fall into the pack. Brand yourself,

market yourself, educate yourself. This is your

game, what are you gonna do with it? How are you

gonna handle it?

JASON: Yeah.

KELLY: how you're gonna stand out, and you're

gonna stand out. You can stand out however way

you want. You can be a super douche. Stand out

that way. I mean, some people really do genuinely

succeed that way. You know?

JASON: But there's a cap.

KELLY: But there's a cap. Or you can handle it,

you know. in a different manner of just having

that being that confident agent who is not going

to... you know, have to constantly, you know,

think they're constantly more. That's exhausting.

It is exhausting.

JASON: What's the name of that book again?

KELLY: The Millionaire Real Estate Agents.

JASON: If you write a review on Apple Podcasts

or Spotify and you go ahead and send a screenshot

of that to at on the Real Estate Pod on Instagram,

we'll put you in a drawing for, to send out that

book.

KELLY: So, does that work? We'll send five Books.

JASON: Five Books.

KELLY: Well, it's really good. I mean, it really

is an amazing book. If you care at all about your

career, you should read it. So I'm willing to

give five people that book.

JASON: Okay, well you heard it here first. So

write a review on Apple Podcasts, screenshot it,

send it to at on the Real Estate Pod on Instagram

and you'll be in a drawing for five.

KELLY: That is a $20 book, so a $100 value.

JASON: Wow, all right, cool. All right, well,

Kelly, this has been an awesome episode. Before

we get you out of here, do you have a can't make

this shit up moment from recently that you wanna

share?

KELLY: I mean, this deal today's driving me nuts.

The lady has an outstanding water bill. We can't

close until she pays it.

JASON: Until she pays a water bill?

KELLY: Yeah. Is that a girl can't make a shut

up?

JASON: Yeah, like why is she not paying the water

bill?

KELLY: People wanna fuck with me today. That's

it. I'm already feeling, bitch, how much is your

watermelon? I will pay it.

JASON: Yeah. How much can it be?

KELLY: I don't know. She hasn't lived in the house

for like three months. So the water bill cannot...

JASON: I mean, like $150 maybe. Oh my gosh. Can't

make this shit up.

KELLY: Yeah, it's driving me crazy. I just think

it's a real estate day. Some days are just better

than others and today it seems to be all kinds

of. insanity at once. But tomorrow will be better.

JASON: That's awesome. All right, well, Kelly,

this has been a great conversation about arrogance,

humbleness, cockiness, being a super douche. It

was so great to see you again.

KELLY: Thank you. Have a good time. Don't forget

our reviews so we can send you how to be a millionaire

real estate agent.

JASON: That's right. All right, everybody. Thanks

for listening. Thanks for watching. If you like

this show, be sure to subscribe on Apple Podcasts

on YouTube, wherever you listen to your podcast.

And we'll be back again soon with the next episode

of On The Real Estate with Kelly DuBois.